Comparing the Titans: Harvard and Yale Law Schools Fight for Number One

Harvard and Yale are the perfect rivals. Students, academics and writers compare each and every aspect of the universities from endowment size to football teams.

The two law schools, ranked the two best in the nation, are no exception.

Harvard Law School (HLS) is bigger. Yale Law School (YLS) is more selective. Harvard uses the traditional grading system. Yale grades students pass/fail. Harvard is more practical, Yale more academic.

The comparisons go on and on.

But, despite the differences, most people say students cannot go wrong at either one.

"Yale's strengths are Harvard's weaknesses, and Harvard's strengths are Yale's weaknesses," says Sarah E. Wald, currently a Harvard assistant provost, who graduated from YLS in 1978 and served as HLS dean of students from 1987-92.

"At either place your going to get a great education and get a great job," she adds.

U.S. News & World Report, however, in its annual rankings of colleges and graduate schools has decided to make a judgement.

For almost as long as the survey has been issued, Yale has been at the top of the chart, and Harvard has been number two.

HLS shrugs off the ranking.

"We don't run a law school based on a magazine. Our ranking has been the same for the last 10 years. If it didn't matter to us 10 years ago, it doesn't matter to us now," says Michael J. Chmura, spokesperson for HLS. "We think we're the best law school in the country."

Does size matter?

One difference between the schools is readily apparent: their class sizes. HLS, with a student body size of 1,666, is almost three times the size of YLS. HLS has the most full-time students of any law school in the country, according to Chmura.

But, despite the difference in the size of the student population, HLS does not hire many more professors. In 1998 HLS had a student to faculty ratio of 20 to 1, compared to 9 to 1 for YLS.

Improving this ratio has been a goal for HLS, and the ratio has dropped significantly from previous years. In the 1986-87 academic year the ratio was 26 to 1. HLS now has more faculty than it ever has in its history.

According to many, the small number of students at YLS, only 573 this year, provides many advantages over Harvard's larger student body.

"Your classes will be small from day one, your professors will know your name...you'll have tons of opportunities to interact with them, and you'll get to know virtually everyone in your year pretty quickly," said Ali Ahsan '99, a first year law student at YLS and a Crimson editor.

One YLS professor says he thinks the smaller student body creates a different atmosphere.

"[The size] makes the institution of Yale Law School feel more humane and like a community," says Jay L. Pottenger Jr., a professor at YLS, who taught at HLS in 1985-86 academic year.

For example, while he was teaching at Harvard, Pottenger says, one day he greeted a student by name in the hall, and she was taken aback and said it was the first time in her three years at the school a professor had said 'hello' or even acknowledged her existence.

Assistant Provost Wald says that Yale's smaller student body means the physical size of the campus is smaller. The classroom and faculty offices are in same building, and dorms are directly across from classroom building. This means that "you have to run into professors," she says.

But, some say, more students means more variety. While it may be virtually impossible to know everybody in your class at HLS, there is a high likelihood of finding fellow students with similar interests.

"There are a critical mass [at HLS] of other students who are interesting in same things," Wald says.

It is also possible for HLS students to maintain some anonymity from their fellow students if they wish, students say.

"Harvard Law School's size affords much more of an opportunity to find your own niche within the school comprising of people who share similar interests," Ahsan says.

In addition, having a larger student body enables HLS to offer a larger quantity and variety of courses. According to The Official Guide to U.S. Law Schools published in 1999, Harvard offers 240 law courses, while Yale offers only 140.

"Sure, there are real advantages to being small," says Robert W. Gordon '63-'67, a professor at YLS who is also a Crimson editor. "But because of the riches of the place, the enterprising Harvard student can find lots of small courses or seminars there as well."

Making the grade

Harvard and Yale law schools have very different grading methodologies. HLS follows the traditional letter grade system, giving students grades ranging from A+ to F. At Yale , students are usually given grades of "honors," "pass," "low pass" and "fail." First semester students are graded solely on a pass/fail system, in which students say it is virtually impossible to fail.

The New York Times reported last month that a faculty committee at HLS is considering adopting a grading system similar to Yale's in the very near future. This committee is being advised by an outside consulting firm.

"The stress level at Yale is certainly much less than at other comparable law schools. This is largely because of the grading system or lack thereof. How hard you work is largely up to you," Ahsan says.

But, he adds, the downside is that students must motivate themselves.

Many HLS students say they are not great fans of their school's system.

"The difference between a B+ and an A- literally tends to come down to the professor's mood, or what paper got read before yours," says Kimberley A. Isbell, a third year HLS student.

Due to the grading system and general perceptions, many think HLS students have a much heavier workload--some say unmanageable--and a higher level of competitiveness than those at Yale.

"Admittedly, I don't feel I have that much extra time and energy for work beyond the classroom, but from what I hear from people I know at Harvard, I do have more time than I would there," says Elizabeth F. Emens, a first year law student at YLS.

Students at HLS say that this heavy workload and level of competitiveness is not the fault of the institution but is due to pressure students put on themselves.

"If you're the type of person who closely reads every word, highlighting in 10 different colors, I don't see how you can take a full course load and still have a life," Isbell says. "If you're willing to skim--and in some cases skip--the reading, it's manageable."

Jonathan S. Freimann, a second year HLS student, says that even though he sees HLS students studying 12 hours a day, there is no reason they need to do this. "They're doing that to themselves," he says.

Gordon says he doubts there is much difference in the level of work demanded at the two schools. However, he adds, differences may appear in the focus of this work

"Yale's environment is only superficially less competitive; and its intellectual culture is intense," Gordon says. "I think Harvard students probably invest a bit more in coursework-preparation and exams, Yale students in writing papers and in work on journals and other enterprises.".

Theory vs. Practice

The differences, however, may extend beyond the basics into the theory of teaching at each school.

Many say that YLS is more interested in the philosophy of the laws, while Harvard's approach is to examine the application of the law.

"Yale is definitely a more 'academic' law school than Harvard," Ahsan says.

"The conventional wisdom is that Harvard is a 'black letter' law school where they teach you what the law is and how best to interpret and apply the law," he adds. "At Yale the institutional emphasis is somewhat more on why the law is the way it is, and how it can be improved. In essence the focus is perhaps more philosophical at Yale."

Yale Professor Gordon, however, plays down the difference.

"Yale's teaching is probably somewhat less oriented to legal doctrine than Harvard's; but the differences are not large," says Gordon. "Maybe YLS has a few more courses whose relationship to traditional legal subjects is oblique: courses with titles like 'Justice' or 'Capitalism'. It's often said that Yale students don't learn as much 'law' but that's only true if you define law narrowly as legal doctrine."

Some Harvard students say neither school is very practical in focus.

"As for Harvard teaching practical legal skills, certainly not," Isbell says. "None of the top tiered schools do. The mid-tier school are much better at 'black letter' law and the mechanics of writing a memo or conducting legal research."

The schools are also perceived to have student bodies with different interests. The typical Harvard student, many say, aspires to traditional corporate law firm practice. At Yale, students typically are oriented more toward fields such as public service, politics or other non-practicing legal fields.

"My theory is that it's true that Yale looks for students who evince some interest in government, politics, teaching, public service, etc," says Adam S. Hickey '99, a first year student at YLS who is also a Crimson editor. "On the other hand, a lot of people seem to come to Yale because it's a good place to come if you don't want to be a lawyer."

Gordon says each school's dean expresses a subtle difference in emphasis that may be responsible for the divergent paths of their schools.

" Harvard's dean believes the primary mission of his school is and ought to be its de facto mission--producing associate fodder for the big firms," Gordon says. "Yale's dean believes strongly that this is too narrow a conception of our school's mission and that we ought to be helping students find diverse careers. These beliefs influence the cultures of the places."

However, the statistics show that differences may not be all that great. While in the first year after graduation, a much larger percentage of Yale's class serves as one-year clerks for judges, by the second year out of school, a large majority of each school's graduates are working in law firms.

While YLS may claim among its graduates the famous political duo of Bill and Hillary Clinton, Chmura notes that HLS has a large number of graduates at the top of national politics. Two cabinet members, 10 U.S. senators and nine members of the U.S. House of Representatives, as well as five of the nine members of the Supreme Court, are graduates of HLS.

In addition, Harvard has loan forgiveness programs for students going into the lower paid public service law fields. This value of this program was increased this year.

One Harvard student says he believes the prevalence of student interest in corporate law firms is a phenomenon endemic of all major law schools.

"Harvard Law School is dominated by corporate mentality," says Freimann.

"I think that's true at all leading law schools," he continues.

So, while magazines like U.S. News & World Report may emphasize the differences between the two law schools, academics and students say they are subtle, if they exist at all.

Yale may be ahead in one ranking, but Harvard is certainly not far behind.